So....."Nigger" = "Fighting Sioux"?????
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I made sure to catch that segment on the news specifically. I liked how the guy was ranting about how the term "Sioux" relates to the past and they don't want to live in the past. Well, I say, if you don't want to live in the past it's about time you gave up your goverment check. After all it's basically reparations for what happened in "the past", my ancestor weren't on the same continent when everything went down, why should I have to pay. Another thing that kind of bothers me is the fact they're bitching about the term "Fighting Sioux", the sioux were warriors and apparently now apparently they're not proud of there heritage, I wonder if the all mighty dollar has anything to do with that. Also, the whole debate didn't seem to blow up until the "white man" had to open his mouth about this.
Sterling Archer: Oh my god! You killed a hooker!
Cyril Figgis: Call girl!
Sterling Archer: No Cyril! When they're dead they're just hookers!
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ichibankilla;196573 wrote:
. Well, I say, if you don't want to live in the past it's about time you gave up your goverment check. After all it's basically reparations for what happened in "the past", my ancestor weren't on the same continent when everything went down, why should I have to pay. .+10
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ichibankilla;196573 wrote:
Another thing that kind of bothers me is the fact they're bitching about the term "Fighting Sioux", the sioux were warriors and apparently now apparently they're not proud of there heritage, I wonder if the all mighty dollar has anything to do with that.In every argument I've heard it has nothing to do with the 'fighting' portion of it. It's the 'Sioux' name because to that group it's derogatory. The 'Sioux' call themselves a different name (which I can't seem to dig up right now)
letter from the United Tribes Council wrote:
Among other things, our Board points out in one of our resolutions of opposition to the name being used at UND that the word "Sioux" is not a name that the Lakota and Dakota peoples of the Great Plains ever called themselves; it is generally considered a corruption of a French word meaning "little snake". The word we use to describe ourselves, "Lakota", or in another dialect, "Dakota", means "ally", or "friend". The Lakota and Dakota peoples are not "honored" by use of the name "Sioux", it is a despicable nickname and is equivalent to African-Americans being referenced by any of a number of terms that are entirely in disrepute today.It really is no different than naming a team the 'niggers' if you really look at how the history of the word 'Sioux'.
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dubbsy;196580 wrote:
It really is no different than naming a team the 'niggers' if you really look at how the history of the word 'Sioux'.K, lets you and me go walk around the mall together. I'll call every Indian a "sioux", you call every black person a "nigger". "It's really no different." Your EMT skills may come in really handy when we're trying to put your liver back in.
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the worst part about this is how many sports teams out there are named after a certain tribe or such offhand the one that pops out is the redskins do u think sioux is worse then a redskin........ not to mention all the college teams that are named after indians the sioux might as well just change there name to the drunks that way their name dosent change to much
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2wheeler;196563 wrote:
Lemme know if I'm understanding what these guys are trying to get across. For anyone who may not have caught the newscasts, one of the "Indians" who is against the Fighting Sioux nickname, likened the term "nigger" to "Fighting Sioux".......and how black people have made the term "nigger" unacceptable, that's how Indians feel about UND using the "Sioux" nickname.WTF??? Really?????
Anyone on this forum with some real Indian heritage wanna voice an opinion about this?
Christ....if Francis(or any other black people)is/are reading this, what's your opinion on "nigger" being on par with "Fighting Sioux"? If I were black, I'd beat those guys with their own peace pipes. Stupid fuckers.
I didn't go to UND, and I could really care how they do in any sports, but, I would think the Indian population would enjoy the recognition and strength UND has received/shown in their programs. When I hear of the Fighting Sioux winning a nat'l championship, the last thing on my mind is how they are mocking the tribe. Or, I guess we could just always think of Indians using the **typical stereotype......drunk, unemployed and useless. **
Oh, and if these guys really want me to take them seriously, something has to be done with their last names. So.........Ron His Horse Is Thunder, Jesse Taken Alive & Avis Little Eagle (real names, I couldn't make this shit up if I tried) shut the fuck up.......please (see...I'm being nice about it.)
LOL OMG THIS IS FUNNY!
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i asked some younger native americans if they were offended by it and they said they could care less. it seems like this is just the older generations of native americans who are getting butt hurt about the sioux name.
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2wheeler;196584 wrote:
K, lets you and me go walk around the mall together. I'll call every Indian a "sioux", you call every black person a "nigger". "It's really no different." Your EMT skills may come in really handy when we're trying to put your liver back in.you know what, it's what's deemed acceptable at that point in history. Take this back 70, 80 years and using the term Nigger will get you no reaction.....
The truth is, African American's view the term 'Nigger' as derogatory.. this group of Native Americans view the term 'Sioux' derogatory...
60 years ago the term 'Nigger' was more 'accepted', today 'Sioux' is more accepted.. 5 years, 10 years.. who knows.
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they shouldnt liken "fighting sioux" to "nigger". how many natives have you heard call another "fighting sioux".
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dubbsy;196593 wrote:
you know what, it's what's deemed acceptable at that point in history.
Exactly, I agree 100%.Right now, these people are being dbags. They are getting the attention that they are starving for. They really need to do something better with their time/energy.
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if they were smart, they would quiet whining and get hooked up with some royalities from the use of the name.
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LOL at this thread. My agreement with everyone else. If they want special treatment like they say, quit taking my fuckin money and ill give your god damn name back.
Plus, i had heard the Ralph put it in the contract that if they change the name they cant use the arena or something like that? not sure just hearsay. BUT, if thats the case, they pay up the fuckin millions of dollars he spent on that place so the school can buy it back.
Gary -
i read that in the paper when it was built, if the name is changed the place gets demo'd
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The Sioux call themselves by that name all the time. Go to Fort Totten, ND. Its on a Sioux Reservation, they have places called Sioux Manufacturing that is owned by the tribe. If they want things to change, I suggest they change it themselves first.
This is coming from a guy who is 25% Native American (though raised 100% German)
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Well here is my opinion and I live in Grand Forks.... UND offers the Native Americans that want to attend their college many benefits. They go to school for free basically. They get scholarships if they do good in there first year of school. They get so many things but they are still not happy. You are never going to make everyone happy in todays society.
I also do believe it is written in Ralph Engelstads will that if they do change the name that it will be boarded up and not used my the University. Thats why if you go in there and look around you will notice that it either says Fighting Sioux, Sioux, or there is emblem whereever you look in that place. I think thats the smartest he could of done is put logos everywhere. It would cost the University millions and millions of dollars to change all the logos and everything. I believe if they get rid of the name get rid of all the things that the natives get. Why should we have to pay to make someone happy?? -
The complaint african americans have is that no matter what name "white people" call them, it's a name that was given to them, not one they chose for themselves. Thus the popularity of "african american".
The Souix complaint doesn't appear to be any different.
The claim that "souix" and "nigger" are the same is probably overblown, as there aren't the large negative cultural connotations with "Souix". For sports teams with names like "Redskins" I think there's a better case for it being derogatory.
What's also problematic is the charicatures of Indians commonly used in sports teams logos. Imagine someone using a blackface or 70s style drawing of a black man (enlarged lips, ultra wide nose, afro, etc) as a sports mascot.
I do think we need to do something about the reservation issue. Many reservations are bastions of povery, drunkenness, etc. I don't remember reading anywhere that people have a right to a certain way of life in perpetuity, all tax-payer subsidized. The Amish for instance do not receive federal subsidization as far as I know.
fwiw, I'm a couple generations removed from full-blooded Winnebago (look it up. They're in Nebraska) Indian, but I self-identify as a caucasian. None of this stuff bothers me, but then not much does. That said, I can see where they're coming from to a degree, which I've tried to outline above.
As an aside, people that look at me think I'm mexican, pacific islander, or any other things, but I'm basically a mutt. You won't see many native americans with the amount of back hair I have.
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