New to Fargo Argument
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bluejays wrote:
price tag?When they were both new and if you figure in inflation and what not....probably not very far from each other. Mine was 22,800 brand new.
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My GSR when it was brand new was probably somewhere around 22-23k being I don't have leather. Fully loaded they were around 24k or so in 2001 when they came standard with leather, immobilizer, etc.
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As a WRX owner, I would just like to make some facts know about them. This is just more of a comparison...not a rant... so chill
My WRX is a Stage 2 COBB setup and makes about 224 hp to all four wheels (285 crank if you must know). I know that is not much and I won't argue that. The AWD kills a lot of the power and that is a big drawback...but it hooks up like a mother... It goes 0-60 in roughly 4.6 secs. However it's 1/4 is still only 13.4 at 101.5mph average taken from this site . Top end is shit because of the AWD setup.....
I would like to point out that it cost me $1715 for the stage 2 package. To me this isn't that much money, because I have a job that supports it. I know that not everyone does. This is not the argument. I am curious how much does it cost for a GSR to be that fast?
Subaru is also one of the leaders in the industry as far as reliability and safety (probably because it is japanese). So... Honda, Acura, Mitsi, and Subaru are on par.
Both cars have their advantages. I don't knock either one. I have a friend that has a Civic SI running really high hp numbers... over 500... and I know how much he spent on his engine and what he did. I have seen quite a few WRX's (not STI's) running over 500 hp on a daily driver setup. These cars have the same work done to them as the Civic for about the same amount of money. Yes they did need to change out the 5 speed for the 6 speed STI tranny...because the 5 speed is weaksauce.... But you can change the gearsset and get the same thing for less money minus the extra gear.
oh...and.... nightriderwrx.... stop hatin... you know you are just jealous...
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toxshox wrote:
As a WRX owner, I would just like to make some facts know about them. This is just more of a comparison...not a rant... so chillMy WRX is a Stage 2 COBB setup and makes about 224 hp to all four wheels (285 crank if you must know). I know that is not much and I won't argue that. The AWD kills a lot of the power and that is a big drawback...but it hooks up like a mother... It goes 0-60 in roughly 4.6 secs. However it's 1/4 is still only 13.4 at 101.5mph average taken from this site . Top end is shit because of the AWD setup.....
I would like to point out that it cost me $1715 for the stage 2 package. To me this isn't that much money, because I have a job that supports it. I know that not everyone does. This is not the argument. I am curious how much does it cost for a GSR to be that fast?
Subaru is also one of the leaders in the industry as far as reliability and safety (probably because it is japanese). So... Honda, Acura, Mitsi, and Subaru are on par.
Both cars have their advantages. I don't knock either one. I have a friend that has a Civic SI running really high hp numbers... over 500... and I know how much he spent on his engine and what he did. I have seen quite a few WRX's (not STI's) running over 500 hp on a daily driver setup. These cars have the same work done to them as the Civic for about the same amount of money. Yes they did need to change out the 5 speed for the 6 speed STI tranny...because the 5 speed is weaksauce.... But you can change the gearsset and get the same thing for less money minus the extra gear.
oh...and.... nightriderwrx.... stop hatin... you know you are just jealous...
Are we talking 500whp here? If so, I'm raising the BS flag. There is almost no way that a US spec EJ20T is going to support 500whp. What kind of turbos are these cars running? T66? SC61? 60-1? GT40's? Those turbos hardly constitute a daily driver 2.0 liter motor as the lag would be severe. Or are we talking about a worthless number like crank HP? Crank HP won't do you one bit of good if the wheels don't see a good portion of it..that would translate to what? 390-410 WHP perhaps on a suby, maybe less. Give me a Dynapack (which seems to be the favored dyno of WRX owners) and those numbers are close to in reach on my car as Mustang Dynos generally read ~40hp lower than others. Had I not hit boosting issues I have no doubt I would have been very close to 350whp and 380 wtq. Oh, and I run 13's (well last year, pre-tune).
You talk about making the switch to an STi 6 speed, last I checked to get a 6 spd was about $6000, to make 500 crank HP is going to run you about another $5000-$6000 minimum. Figure in labor and you can easily factor in another $2000, that puts you at $14k in mods on a $23,000 car (if you buy new). I really think you need to check your facts about subies before making the claims you have made.
Chuck
PS. I own a WRX
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dont think just a cobb stage 2 will run 13.4 with a wrx, until you do the real thing. I ran 13.1 with a stage 2 set up but without EMS. All i gotta do is make a fuel map for it to stop the damn fuel cuttin and ill go better.
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STiSchucky wrote:
dont think just a cobb stage 2 will run 13.4 with a wrx, until you do the real thing. I ran 13.1 with a stage 2 set up but without EMS. All i gotta do is make a fuel map for it to stop the damn fuel cuttin and ill go better.You shouldn't have any fuel cut, the switch on your UTEC for disabling the stock ECU's fuel cuti is in the position so that you no longer have fuel cut (might wanna double check that...read your manual) what I think you're running into is knock detection and your car is pulling timing...oh, and maybe check the user parameters and see where your max MAP is set at...if its set at 19 or 20 you might wanna raise it a bit if you plan on playing in those boost levels.
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well whatever it is, around 3800rpms itll just detonate/cut
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add fuel
pull timinghave you datalogged at all? Whats the AFR when you are detonating?
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btw, this is where someone will usually say I'm picking on the newbie (toxshox)....sorry, I don't like it when wrong info is given about wrx's, I think I've been around them long enough to make my points clearly and accurately.
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tjamz wrote:
add fuel
pull timinghave you datalogged at all? Whats the AFR when you are detonating?
high 10s. close enough -
that should be fine....hmmmm.....try pulling timing, do a datalog of the run, you should be able to see knock count at what RPM and Load you were running at. You might wanna look at the fuel map as well and just make sure there isn't a "lean" spot in it anywhere (something that only lasts for maybe 1-2 points on the map right around the point where you start noticing knock). If you notice a lean spot on the map, add fuel in that spot and make another run....better yet, do a datalog and send me a copy of it along w/ a copy of your maps (Stage 2 and the map that was tuned by RS)
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kevin thinks its also im runnin to much boost on 92 oct.
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yeah, that would do it too
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how much boost?
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If its over 19-20 its too much
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it is :).
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yeah...you might wanna back that boost down unless you wanna rebuild that motor soon....subies HATE detonation, even the 2.5's
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simple urban myths. nah jk, ive been running stock settnig the whole time. i tried a 2 hammers on the way to the shop tonight and got it so i put it back on map 0. i named stage 2, track day only stage. even tho stage 0 pulls pretty nice, in terms of 92 oct. wise
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Still, if you're running that much boost on 92.....its gonna be expensive fast....unless you were j/k about the whole deal, then nevermind
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DAMNIT KIRK, we took a perfectly good argument and went all off topic and made it into a discussion about car parts, nice going fag.
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