Plane on a conveyor belt

[harm]

okay.. I haven't read the last six pages of this yet.. but I love this thread.

note in my second post (the unedited one) I said yes, it's going to take off
..and still got ripped on for saying it wasn't, even after explaining why it would.
nobody reads my posts anyway, yeah.. I like throwing fuel on the fire. can't believe we made 6 more pages while I was at work.. and I can't believe how loud the music next door is right now.

Bah, I'm going to read 15-20+ when I get back from dinner. tjamz, good thread. I can't believe we're still arguing it at this point, unless I try to (not) think like I was thinking this morning. what I was saying seemed to make sense then.

plane takes off, if we take the facts stated in the question as absolutes.

[JN210]

tjamz;199323 wrote:
GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

let me spell this out

plane moves ----------------------------------------> at 180mph (relative to ground)

conveyor moves <------------------------------------------ at 180mph (relative to ground)

wheels spin clockwise at the same rate they would if the plane were traveling 360mph (180mph rotation from each force being applied to them).

Plane DOES NOT SIT STILL, the engines are pushing it ----> at 180mph. The plane is moving 180mph (I use 180mph as that is the speed a 747 needs for takeoff) vs the stationary ground.

There is absolutely no way (with a properly functioning plane) that the conveyor can prevent the plane from rolling forward along its surface. The conveyor does not/can not keep the plane from moving forward. If it can, I challenge you and your teacher to show me the physics on how it can be held in place (aside from anchoring the plane to the ground)

Basically, you are confusing speed with force. The conveyor does not produce enough force to hold the plane stationary. Period.

Please tell me your physics teacher did not tell you to type that response either. If so, it explains a lot about why kids are dumber than ever before (and if so, yes that was a direct shot at you and your physics teacher...if not, it was just a shot at you.)

I will not take it as a "shot" but I will ignore it and im still sticking to my answer that no it wont fly.:icon_cheers:

[JN210]

bubba;199339 wrote:
I said cliff notes when someone's posts are like a couple paragraphs long...not on a whole thread...reading > u...noob

Obviously your english teachers fail at life too....

I go to a school out in the middle of frickin nowhere....go figure...

[harm]

can we add another poll on this? I'm wondering how many people still think yes or no.. currently.

it's weird that three more people have picked "no" since this morning. because the answer is still yes. just like it was when i said no. i'm still ashamed of myself.. my grasp of physics while I'm still half-asleep is usually better. heh.

[uman44]

The whole point of this argument is to point out that airplanes aren't propelled by their wheels like a car is, thus going against what is normal for anyone who considers themselves a car guy.

I asked my dad (Airplane Mechanic at the Air Gaurd, worked on F16's and crap his whole life) and he was quick to answer yes. It just shows that jet powered things (Airplanes or Supras) use thrust not friction

New question for idiots... will an airplane take off in a vacuum?

[Guest]

What I think is funny is that mythbusters proved it flies (I provided links), the youtube link I posted proves the plane can move forward on a moving treadmill and yet people still think the plane cannot take off.

This is almost as bad as telling someone a car engine can be designed w/o pistons and them not believing it, even after you've just shown them a working rotary motor.

[capitlj]

tjamz;199292 wrote:
glad you asked...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EopVDgSPAk

How long were you sitting on that one?

[Afsil80]

MisterCMK;199338 wrote:
Dammit Dave, answer my post about a jet engine on a Supra!!!

That's a dumb question, because if a jet and a Supra were to swap powerplants, the Supra wouldn't be as fast as it normally would and the 2JZ would make the jet so fast that it's wings would fall off and it wouldn't get off the stupid conveyor belt.

Duh!

[JN210]

I disregard my last answer...I agree with tjamz, My teacher is VERY wrong and yes the plane WILL fly, I talked with my dad about it last night and he knows VERY well about this stuff so he gave me an example.

If a train (a train big enough for a plane to land on) is moving 200mph -------------->
and a plane is moving 200mph<-----------

and the plane somehow lands on this train will it stop flying?......the answer is no, just because the wheels are moving doesnt mean it isnt flying, the wheels are just moving faster so the plane doesnt really care if its on a conveyor or not, in the end it will take off!!!

Thank you education system:icon_scratch:??
This must prove that parents know more than teachers think they do....lol

[Guest]

Tell your dad I said thanks,

[JN210]

will do, I guess I should've thought more.

[Guest]

Tjamz has my end covered! The plane will fly!

[JN210]

Too bad my teacher still doesnt think it will fly....does it make a difference if he is canadian?

[inspector01]

I have gone over this before, and i don't feel like reading everything, but yes it will fly because wheels have nothing to do with a plane flying as long as the wind moving across the wings is fast enough to lift it. The wind moving over the top goes faster (less pressure when air is moving) so there is more pressure below pushing it up. How would float planes and ski planes work with no wheels??

[JN210]

Bringing this back from the dead......Mythbusters is taking this to the test on Wednesday (From what I hear)

[weshole]

It will take off!! That's my prediction. I'm not going to try and explain, it's just how my minds eye sees it.

[JN210]

I agree, I am expecting it to take off.

[Bassplayer]

I'm just wondering how the plane gets enough lift to raise it. If its not moving than the only air would be that from the propellor. Idk we'll what happens this wednesday, I'd say depending on the plane it won't talk off. If they get an F16 theres no way any belt can go 800mph and that would take off.

[capitlj]

Why would the plane not move though? The wheels do not propel it forward, otherwise it would not fly. It will take off.

[Guest]

Bassplayer;202983 wrote:
I'm just wondering how the plane gets enough lift to raise it. If its not moving than the only air would be that from the propellor. Idk we'll what happens this wednesday, I'd say depending on the plane it won't talk off. If they get an F16 theres no way any belt can go 800mph and that would take off.

*<u>**Point to the part in the question where it states that the belt holds it stationary. *</u> You can't because that is NOT how the question is stated. It can "match the speed" in the opposite direction, but that does not mean that the plane isn't moving (in fact it HAS to be moving for the belt to move in the first place). What it CAN do is spin the wheels at twice their normal rate, but this will have virtually no affect on whether the plane moves forward or not....it might shorten the life of the tires and/or bearings, but that is all.